Naughty Employer!

[acwoking]

My wife just got paid £1.42 for 4 weeks work!

She works as a carer for elderly clients and she has just completed an NVQ level 2 in Social Health Care. This was not government funded. (I checked with the learning skills council, she was not eligible)

At the beginning of June she handed her notice in and today is her last day. Last week her employer deducted the sum of the NVQ costs from her wages in one hit.

We have never disputed the fact that we owe this money because she signed a letter at the beginning of this year, saying she had to pay it back if she left the company.

However the letter she signed did not say how the company would recoup this money. We certainly did not expect them to deduct the whole lot in one go. I have checked her employment terms and conditions and her employee handbook and there is no mention of how the money had to be repaid. Their actions have left us broke and we are having to borrow from all and sundry to put food on the table.

We offered to pay a lump sum and then 12 monthly installments that we could afford. A reasonable gesture of repayment. The total cost of the NVQ is £1050. The director has refused to give this money back.

Any advice please? Has this happened to you?

[Ian J]

I would think that the company have acted entirely reasonably as they have effectively loaned your wife the money to increase her skill levels and having now done this your wife has decided to leave their employment.

I would have thought that in such circumstances it would have been obvious that they would want to be repaid prior to your wife leaving

[Nick Dyer]

I would agree with Ian.

If the employer does not recoup the outstanding money in the final salary payment then how would they get paid the money?
Unfortunately it look slike the employer is fully entitled to retain the cash as agreed and it seems totally reasonable to do that against the final salary payment.

[acwoking]

Thanks for your comments. As i said in my post we did not dispute the fact we owe the money but having done some research i found the following...

S13 of the Employment Rights Act 1996 states that an employer may not make deductions from the wages of an employed worker unless:
* The deduction is required or authorised by statute;

* The deduction is authorised by a relevant provision of the worker's contract of employment, or;

* The worker has previously given his or her written agreement or consent to the deduction being made.

Now as I have said already she was not aware that they were going deduct such a large amount from the salary and it was not written anywhere in either her contract of emploment nor the letter they made her sign! The method of collection should have been an expressed term of the contract not implied!

Had it been we would have budgeted for this event and not had to borrow off of friends and family to put food on the table for our family.

[acwoking]

Ian & Nick another thought...Its not just employee's that benefit from formal training. I think you will find it also benefits and enhances the employers reputation and standing in their chosen markets.

As I explained to the director of this firm he is entitled to have his investment back but why not in a reasonable way?

[EVRYEDGE]

Wow, that sucks!!!

[T-Switch]

So your wife hands in her notice. Then over the duration of a month, you don't bother approaching the employer in regards to how the moneys were to be repaid?

You should of opened some form of dialogue in that month. As you didn't, he/she probably felt you were ignoring that responsibility.

I think its too late now to approach him/her and/or go to courts (takes too long etc).

[squalid]

I think that you have three months to apply for an industrial tribunal.

But i cant see the point. They may say ' Yes the money shouldnt have been taken at once ' depending on the contact etc

But then they would also say - you owe the money.

And so one would cancel out the other.

I couldnt see them making an award which would be telling the company to give you a loan that you could pay back.

I have been shafted before by employees leaving and owing money - I would have done exactly the same as them.

[LimeLegal]

The agreement to deduct monies for training is challengable in law as my understanding is the training at NVQ level 2 for care workers was made mandatory in 2005/06. The cost of the legal fees to do this would probably outweigh the benefits and as the money has already been taken there is little by way of bargaining power here to levy on the employer.

[acwoking]

Hey guys thanks for your posts.

I did speak to the employer and I told him he would get his money and I asked for some time to get it arranged. I spoke to the director and told him i would give him a lump payment up front and the rest in affordable monthly installments. He refused and was not willing to negotiate. At no time did he tell my wife that he was just going to take it from her pay! I have been polite and tried to reason with the man but he's just not interested in compromise.

My wifes last salary payment from this company is due next Friday. I am beginning to wonder if he will pay this. My wife remained professional even after the £1.42 salary advice and worked her notice even having to borrow money from our 10 year old son so she could put fuel in her car to get to her clients.

Another issue that worries us is that he has made most of his carers sign this ambiguous letter when i know for a fact that the funding for the NVQ for all but two of the carers has been funded by the government. I know he will insist other employees pay up if they wish to leave. Can he do that even though the government have paid?

The letter they all signed stated the cost of training was £1200. It was not until I spoke to the learning skills council that i discovered the true cost was £1050 hmmmmm????

Unlawful deduction of wages is the reason why we have asked to meet him again under the company grievance procedures and if he ignores this (21 days left to respond) we will go to an employment tribunual and not only argue our case, we will request that the actions he has taken negate his claim on the money we owe to him.

Further more i want him forced to change the contracts he has made the other carers in his employment (some of whom are friends of my wife) sign so the terms and conditions are expressed for all to see and agree on!